We are so pleased to have interviewed another one of Lionrock's talented employees for this week's episode! Nicole has over 12 years experience working in the alcohol addiction arena. Her background ranges from offering treatment options to exemplary customer service, and an acumen for sales and connecting with others. Nicole attended the University of Phoenix and completed a Bachelor of Science in Human Services, and a Master of Science in Psychology. She has also has earned certificates in Addiction and Health Management, as well as Family and Child Services. Nicole shares her quick wit and amazing sense of humor, along with the difficult details in her journey to sobriety. Join Ashley and Nicole as they sit down for a one of a kind interview.
#17: We are so pleased to have interviewed another one of Lionrock's talented employees for this week's episode! Nicole has over 12 years experience working in the alcohol addiction arena. Her background ranges from offering treatment options to exemplary customer service, and an acumen for sales and connecting with others. Nicole attended the University of Phoenix and completed a Bachelor of Science in Human Services, and a Master of Science in Psychology. She has also has earned certificates in Addiction and Health Management, as well as Family and Child Services.
Nicole shares her quick wit and amazing sense of humor, along with the difficult details in her journey to sobriety. Join Ashley and Nicole as they sit down for a one of a kind interview.
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Show Notes:
5:30 - CoDA (Codependency Anonymous), ADHD and the roots of Nicole’s codependency in childhood
9:17 - Being separated from mainstream class due to her ADHD
10:18 - Being reintegrated back into mainstream school
11:45 - Drinking as a high schooler on a cruise
14:25 - The mental obsession that ensued after discovering alcohol
21:30 - The "invisible line”
22:35 - Rules around usage and DUI’s
26:10 - Getting into a relationship and being forced to give up drinking due to pregnancy
30:50 - Nicole’s daughter is born with a heart defect
35:17 - Making the gut-wrenching decision to take her daughter off life support, and the grief that ensued
37:14 - Trying to control her using/drinking
43:52 - Getting to her moment of clarity
51:35 - Staying sober and what saved her
54:11 - Going through counseling, meeting her current husband and the effects of going through the CoDA steps
58:20 - What life looks like today
1:01:38 - Staying sober through her husband’s relapse
The Courage to Change: A Recovery Podcast would like to thank our sponsor, Lionrock Recovery, for their support. Lionrock Recovery is an online substance abuse counseling program where you can get help for drinking or drug use from the privacy of your own home. For more information, visit http://www.lionrockrecovery.com.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Hello beautiful people. Welcome to the Courage to Change, a recovery podcast. My name is Ashley Loeb Blassingame. I am your host. Today, we have Nicole Ory. Nicole has over 12 years experience working in the alcohol addiction arena. Her background ranges from offering treatment options to exemplary customer service and an acumen for sales and connecting with other people. Nicole attended University of Phoenix and completed a bachelors of science in human services and a masters of science in psychology. She has also earned certificates in addiction and health management as well as family and child services. Nicole is a badass B.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Before coming to Lionrock Recovery to work in admissions, she actually worked with families helping facilitate adoptions and has done some really amazing work. She is a friend of mine. She is a colleague of mine. Her story is one of those where it's hard to hear. It's gut wrenching, but it's one that really shows how, if you do the work, you can stay sober no matter what, through anything. The grief that she dealt with losing her daughter, Addison, is obviously unlike any other pain that a person goes through, and she has been able honor her daughter's memory while also being an amazing stepmother to her daughter, Emilia, and having longterm recovery. So, without further ado, please enjoy Nicole Ory, episode 17. Let's do this.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Nicole, welcome to the program. So happy to have you here.
Nicole Ory:
I am happy to be here.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
This is so fun. Nicole and I actually met when we were... I think we were just trying to figure out, like what? Like a week. No, not a week.
Nicole Ory:
Weeks.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
In the first year of sobriety.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I feel like maybe ASCYPAA in Prescott.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. So, at Young Peoples. Young Peoples, I feel like... I mean, we all did really embarrassing stuff, because we were in our early 20s, but who doesn't do really embarrassing stuff in their early 20s?
Nicole Ory:
But, we had to remember all of it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Exactly. Yeah, that is definitely the downside. Not only do we remember it, but-
Nicole Ory:
Everyone else did.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
All of our friends were sober too. These are the pitfalls of getting sober young. There are some. I don't know. I was talking about this in the first pod, which was when I told my story, which was I needed that camaraderie so much. The Young Peoples, the vibrant energy of the Young Peoples conference and meetings was so vital for giving me that when I was... Because, I thought that my life was over when I got sober.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I definitely thought getting sober equaled death of fun, and I thrived on drama and chaos still, and needed all of it, and [inaudible 00:03:17] sobriety.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, so we went to all the Young Peoples conferences. I've found I've aged out a little bit.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, me too. And, my husband's a little older and I was like, "Yeah, I'm going to be on ICYPAA," because I served on ICYPAA Arizona in 2013. And he was like, "You're not young though."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Wait. Tell people what ICYPAA is.
Nicole Ory:
And I was like, "Well, that's really rude." ICYPAA is the International Conference of Young People in AA.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
And, that's really rude. Well, that's really rude.
Nicole Ory:
He's a lot older. He's 44, I'm 36. He's trying to take me up to his age. I'm like, "No. Come down to mine."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, come down to my level.
Nicole Ory:
Sorry. [inaudible 00:03:57].
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I think it's young at heart. That's what I was told. I remember seeing people who were like-
Nicole Ory:
Yes. Room to grow. As long as you have room to grow. But, now I feel weird now.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I don't know. When I go, I'm like, everybody's vaping and staying out till two in the morning, and I'm like, Netflix and chill means Netflix and actually chill to me. It actually means just hang out. I like me some room service and definitely am not interested in having other people in my bed, not even my husband. He gets his own bed. It's a whole different game.
Nicole Ory:
I'm not cramming nine people into one hotel room for a cheap room.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Exactly. Yeah, yeah. It'll be lucky if I'm sharing a room with anyone. Yeah, it's just a totally different thing.
Nicole Ory:
It saved my life.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
It saved my life. That's what I was going to say.
Nicole Ory:
I used my student loans on it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, no.
Nicole Ory:
I did. It's real sad.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's a whole different story. Yeah, it saved my life. It saved my life being able to get... Because, I got sober at 19. You got sober at how old?
Nicole Ory:
23.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
23. Yeah, yeah.
Nicole Ory:
I also didn't know I was that much older than you. I mean, it's four years, but when you get older four years feels like a lot.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I feel like four years feels like more when you're younger than it does older. I mean, because I thought we were the same age.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Well, you look very young.
Nicole Ory:
Thank you.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. You're skin is glowing.
Nicole Ory:
It's the makeup.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
So okay, you got sober at 23. You have some interesting experiences to share, one of which is that you have worked the 12 steps in Codependency Anonymous, and you sponsor in CODA, which is so rad. Where did your codependency start, because that's a childhood thing. That's a validation early on being addicted to other people. Can you talk about that?
Nicole Ory:
For sure. I think that way before, or I know that way before I got a drink validation was my first high. It was my first drug. Home life was a little chaotic. I had really young parents. I mean, not like 16, but they were in their early 20s, no tools. I felt uncomfortable a lot as a kid. I had ADHD, was on Ritalin. It was early 80s. Not a lot of people knew about ADHD. My mother would take-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
So, it had to had been real bad.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. It was bad. And I had this counselor that my mother told me about later, and he should not be practicing. He told my mom, you need to break her will.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, geez.
Nicole Ory:
She tried. She was like, this isn't right. Something's not right here. She would take books to my teachers explaining what ADHD was, like please read this. I went through three different schools, so I always felt a part of... I had to go to the nurse's station to get my medication during lunchtime, so I felt separated.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You mean not a part of.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You said always felt a part of.
Nicole Ory:
Not a part of. I never felt a part of.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I was like, no, no.
Nicole Ory:
I felt very separate. I started doing things to get validated.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Right, because you were being told you were bad or whatever it was.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, exactly.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
There's something wrong with you. How old were you when you were diagnosed with ADHD?
Nicole Ory:
Six. Ritalin worked, which was probably why I never liked meth, to be honest. I tried, because it was cheap. I really wanted it to work, and it didn't work. I was like, hmm, I just feel sweaty, and gross, and calm.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
And calm.
Nicole Ory:
But, I'm sweating.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, yeah. Pretty sure it's time for school. Okay, and I'm sweating. I know, I totally relate to that too. I was like, wait, is this fun? Is this what we're going to call fun, because I don't feel like having fun. Feel like I'm going to die. It was bad.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, I was like, oh my god, can someone explain to me why we're doing this? And then, I would have to drink so... Yeah, meth was-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Meth was terrible.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, it was not a great thing. Turns out it's not very good for you either.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Chemicals.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. So yeah, validation, big deal. I just wanted love. I just wanted to feel unconditional love. I didn't feel unconditional love at home. I felt like it was very conditional.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Are you an only child?
Nicole Ory:
Only child. No one to blame shit on. Just me. That was it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
And all the focus on you. I didn't really you were an only child. Yeah.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, so I felt like I had to be really, really, good to get love. That was my perception. I don't know if that's how it really was, but that's how I felt. And, I couldn't be really, really, good. It was not in me. I had this abnormal reaction to life of you're always going to be hyperactive.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
But, hyperactive isn't necessarily good or bad. That's a whole other topic, but hyperactivity isn't in and of itself bad. It just doesn't go well with a sit-
Nicole Ory:
School.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Down school system.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, exactly
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
It's not, whatever.
Nicole Ory:
So, in fourth grade I had to go to this special ed class, which separated again. I had no special needs. I was smart. I could do the work. I just got bored quickly, and then I would start walking around the room and start talking. One time, I threw glue at a secretary. That was fucked up. But, I was so angry. I didn't know what to do. I just had all this emotions in me. No one saying, "Hey, what's going on, Nicole? How are you doing?" It was just like, how do we fix her?
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Do you think you could've even verbalized what was going on had someone said that?
Nicole Ory:
No. Mm-mm (negative). I can barely verbalize what I want, I mean, now. I wasn't doing that at eight. I'm complaining to my husband, "I just need help." He's like, "With what?" I'm like, "I don't know."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Help me. What? You're fine. I don't know. Just do it. Whatever it is.
Nicole Ory:
I know. I'll think about it. I went to this school for three years and then I got mainstreamed back. I made this goal, I'm going to be cool. I'm going to be accepted. But, I didn't know how to be a friend, because it was just chaos. I would go through each group and be like a chameleon of, what do you need me to be so that you will be my friend? So, codependency. Let me be accepted by you, because I felt like if anyone knew what was going on in my head they wouldn't want to be around me, which is also like a lot of people who suffer or have alcoholism. It's just the thoughts always going, going, going. Made it through junior high. Started smoking pot in junior high. I don't know if I was inhaling. I remember being at my friend's house-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You were, and Bill Clinton.
Nicole Ory:
I remember being at a friend's house and everyone else is taking these massive hits. I'm like, "This joint's rolled too tight," like I knew what that meant. It's because I was trying to take like a cigarette. I didn't know you had to like [inaudible 00:11:19].
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You were like a bad drug addict.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I didn't know how. Yeah. That was the beginning stages. But, I kept trying, and I succeeded. Practice makes perfect, right? I started drinking. I went on this...
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Wait. How old were you?
Nicole Ory:
I remember at least, probably 14.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Okay.
Nicole Ory:
14, yeah. Should I say this? Okay, so we went to Mexico with my parents, and went on this booze cruise. It was right before I was going into high school. My friend Amy was with us. You can drink in Mexico. Yeah, right, 14. It was fun. I drank a lot. I look at my 10-year-old now and I'm like, there's no way I would let you drink with me, but don't... It was good for me then. I don't know what my mom was thinking, but-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
But, maybe made you less hyperactive.
Nicole Ory:
Well, I got into some trouble out there. I escaped with these guys from Texas that were surfers.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Escaped?
Nicole Ory:
I escaped my parents.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Escaped.
Nicole Ory:
Me and my friend went to their house in Mazatlan. We're in Mazatlan. We don't tell my mom where we're going. We didn't do anything. We were lied and said we were seniors. I mean, we looked 14, but they were like, "Okay." We get back and my mom's threatening to send us both to the US, because she was panicked. Anything could've happened out there.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, for sure. Missing teenage-
Nicole Ory:
I don't how this story's really relevant, but I just thought of it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Missing teenage girls in Mexico tends to freak a mother out.
Nicole Ory:
Really pretty white girls in Mexico, I mean.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I could see how that could be terrifying.
Nicole Ory:
Really gorgeous girls.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Well, I mean, if the truth fits.
Nicole Ory:
That's my first drinking thought of like... And, it was just go, like this is what I was missing. I feel like, as a kid, I always... They say, a lot of times in AA there's there's this spiritual malady, mental obsession, phenomenon of craving. Those are the three parts of AA, or the disease of alcoholism. For me, my spiritual malady came in the form of, if I had different parent, I wore different clothes, I went to a different school, I lived in California instead of Arizona, we had a different house, they drove a different car, all of these things externally were different, then I would be okay. That's what I was always seeking through friends, and clothes, and just whatever externally, then I would be okay.
Nicole Ory:
I didn't know that I had a mental obsession for alcohol. I mean, there was no mental obsession for alcohol before I ever drank it. Once I drank it on that booze cruise and in Mexico, there was no turning it off. The phenomemon of craving was there. Once I have one... Nine times out of 10, unless I'm removed from the situation, I continue to drink. After that experience, then I had a mental obsession, because that fixed all of those external things that I wished were different. It didn't matter anymore. My perception was different. Internally, I felt okay as long as alcohol was in me. On Monday, I would go to school, in high school, and be like, "Okay, how are we going to get loaded on Friday?"
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
With that, what's coming to mind for me is that, I think, so many people think that, well, yeah, you're a teenager. You want to get drunk. That's part of high school. The friends that didn't end up as turning out to be alcoholics, what do you think the difference between you and them was?
Nicole Ory:
No one was trying to figure out how to get loaded on Friday when I was. They didn't have that mental obsession.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You mean on Monday?
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. So, on Monday I'm like, "Okay, who's going to get the alcohol? Where are we going?"
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
For Friday.
Nicole Ory:
They're like, "Nicole, it's Monday." And I'm like, "Yeah, but..." I couldn't be okay until I knew I was going to get to feel that way again, and none of them cared.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
They just knew it was going to happen.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. They were like, "We'll figure it out." I'm like, "But, can we figure... I need to know now." It was like I was an alien is what I felt like. That's the difference. There have been a couple people from that time period that did get sober. But, most of them just... They were able to just go through life, and they seemed a lot more confident than I did. I felt super insecure all the time. As soon as I got alcohol in me, I felt secure. It was like, oh, I can breathe again.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. I get that. Yeah. I get that. It's funny. I don't know if you have this experience, but I took that, "I can't be calm unless I know what's going to happen on Friday, on Monday," I took that with me into my sobriety too. I have a very hard time with uncertainty and not knowing how things are going to turn out. My head tells me that if I don't know how something's going to play out, then it's going to end badly. It's never like, oh, I don't know how this is going to turn out. It's going to be great. It's like, I don't know how this going to turn out. It's going to be a total colossal failure. I'm going to end up at the bottom of the sea. In my head is sure that if there's an unknown, then it's going to be bad.
Nicole Ory:
Do you have a lot of unknowns right now?
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
It could be anything. It could be any-
Nicole Ory:
I'm like, what's going on? Okay, let's [inaudible 00:16:46].
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
No. Wrong.
Nicole Ory:
Oh, okay.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Fake news.
Nicole Ory:
Okay.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Fake news. No. It's something I've had to practice, where it's like-
Nicole Ory:
I get it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Where it's like, okay, I don't know whether or not... I don't know what school my kids are going to go to. Well, they're two.
Nicole Ory:
That's the worst though, trying to find a school for your kid.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
But, my kids are two.
Nicole Ory:
I know, but still. It's scary. We just did it. We just switched schools. I have a lot of anxiety over it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Anxiety about it, okay. Yeah, so, but then, I'm like, I'm sure they're going to end up at Guantanamo Bay. It's either the perfect school or Guantanamo Bay. That's what I'm thinking. That's what goes on in my head. Well maybe they'll end up at another good school. Maybe they'll end up at the perfect school that you didn't know about. Nope, nope, nope, nope. If don't know what's going to happen, if I don't know what school they're going to end up at-
Nicole Ory:
Guantanamo. I mean, that's a riot. They might end up there someday. I hope they don't, because they're really sweet.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
They're really sweet, but hopefully, because they're citizens, that'll help. That'll take out the international piece of it. You don't know. You don't know what's going to happen. Both their parents are alcoholics.
Nicole Ory:
I don't know a lot about things, though.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I'm just saying. I'm not saying my two-year-olds are going to Guatmo. I'm just saying that's where my head goes. This just took a deep dive.
Nicole Ory:
Reel back in.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Reel it back. Okay, coming back. Okay, so you found your solution.
Nicole Ory:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Solution was there. It was great. Went through high school. Actually, I switched high schools and found this lovely place called Sun Valley in Mesa. I was talking to this girl on the plane coming here, and she was like, "Oh, so what high school did you go to?" And I was like, "Well, I went to Coronado and then I went to Sun Valley." And she goes, "Oh, the school for the bad kids." I was like, "Yeah, that's where I went."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
She actually said the school-
Nicole Ory:
She literally said that. She was the same age as me. She went to school in Mesa. She's like, "Yeah. That's where all the bad kids got sent." I was like, "Yeah. It was a lot of fun." And it was.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's my experience with alternative... We called it alternative school. Alternative school was dope.
Nicole Ory:
We had a daycare there. I got to work in it for an elective.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's amazing. No, dude, alternative school, I learned how to do coke there.
Nicole Ory:
You did?
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah.
Nicole Ory:
I knew how to do coke going in.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I didn't. I met up with my friends at my previous school, and was like, "Yeah, so I did cocaine." They were looking at me like, you're gross.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, and you're like, "I have arrived."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I was like, "I'll never see you again." I'm like, "No. There's a whole world out there."
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, like, "You guys have no idea."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I was so excited to tell them. They just were like, "Oh."
Nicole Ory:
They're not on the level.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Nope.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I thought alternative school, I mean, I loved it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Perfectly honest with you, it was awesome.
Nicole Ory:
I probably wasn't great for my spirit, but it was great for activities.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, and we started at 10:00 and ended at 3:00, and had smoke breaks in high school.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, we were able to smoke on campus. That was great. I don't know what time we started. I think we had Friday half days. I was able to use my work hours for credits for electives.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
What you're saying is, yeah, basically were really well educated in high school.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, it was good.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Well, I mean, you know.
Nicole Ory:
It was a good school though.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, tell us more about the academic rigor.
Nicole Ory:
I don't want say it was a bad school.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Talk to me about the academic rigor of the Sun Valley school.
Nicole Ory:
It helped a lot of people graduate high school that wouldn't have otherwise.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Right. Like you.
Nicole Ory:
I probably would've graduated. What happened was, I had gotten in a physical altercation with my last friend that I had at Coronado.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Naturally.
Nicole Ory:
I was like, I can't go back there again. I have no friends. I was like, I'll try this school. And then, I met a lot of friends. They were like me.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Turns out the kids at the alternative school are a lot like me. I had that experience too.
Nicole Ory:
I graduated a year early from all my work hours.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh man, Rhodes scholar.
Nicole Ory:
Because, we didn't have sports or anything like that. We had a daycare.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You're legitimately playing this place up.
Nicole Ory:
It's really good for people who need a different route to graduate, and I needed that. I graduated high school-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Early.
Nicole Ory:
Early, a year early, class of 2000. They talk about this invisible line that we cross, that's where... When graduated high, that summer, I mean, it was fun, a lot of fun, but there was no... I mean, I don't know if there was every normal drinking, but there was no going back after that. I mean, we drank. We had a couple houses we partied at. We drank always, and coke, and pot, and I don't know. They were probably doing some other stuff. But, those were my main three things that I wanted to get down with.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Well, in the beginning, I had rules of ways I was going to keep myself within whatever I believed to be the normal range. For me, mine was I'll never drink and drive. I'll never use needles. I'll never... I had these different things. Depending on where it was, I know I won't use alone. All these things that I thought kept me away from a problem. I laugh, because I was still doing things that were abnormal. Did you have rules around your usage trying to control that?
Nicole Ory:
Not that summer. I had rules my last year of using. I got a DUI. As soon as I made it to this alternative school, I got my first DUI a month after I was there. Okay, so it was my first time getting my DUI. I've had three DUIs, 16, 19, 22. Around 19, when I got that second DUI, I tried to make rules. I was like, there's a problem. None of my other friends have two DUIs.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Okay, so the second DUI was... The first DUI was oopsy. The second DUI was this is-
Nicole Ory:
The first DUI happened because there was this really cute boy and I was about to get sick. I was like, I got to get out of this house now. I threw up in my car. I got pulled over by highway patrol. My poor mother had to come pick me up at whatever time it was. I went to juvy for a night. My parents paid my fines. No consequences, really. I lost my license for three years. That was a major consequence.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's a major consequence.
Nicole Ory:
I get it back for a month, I get a second DUI in my poor mother's car. Yeah. I lose my license again.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Why did you, and I'm asking this for the people who are learning about the four As of us exotic animals, why would you drink and drive a month after getting your license back? How does that-
Nicole Ory:
This story is so ridiculous. I first got a minor in consumption at 6:00 a.m. at a house party. I was also not... I was on coke and drinking.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
We call that an MIC.
Nicole Ory:
That was amazing. That night was amazing. Actually, I don't remember it that much, but I'm sure it was amazing, because I had the right combination. If the right combination's there, I know it's a good night. I'm like, "I'll talk to the cops."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, lord.
Nicole Ory:
Because, I'm not sober at all. I think, I'm probably the most sober here. That's my head, I'm the most sober here so I'll talk to them. It's not even my house. Why am I trying to be hero? Codependency, right?
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
[inaudible 00:24:45].
Nicole Ory:
I'll save you guys.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Try to be the hero.
Nicole Ory:
I get a minor in consumption. Then, I'm like, I have my mom's car. I live with her. I don't want to pay those repercussions, so I ask the cop, "Can I drive home?" I swear to god he tells me yes, because he probably knows I'm not stupid. I get in the car and I turn it on, and he arrests me for a DUI.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Are you kidding me?
Nicole Ory:
No. It was insane. I go to jail for that in the Tent City, which we don't have that anymore. Let's not even get on that creature. Yeah, I go in Tent City in January.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
If you don't know what Arizona Tent City is, that's a Google search for you.
Nicole Ory:
Oh, yeah. It's miserable. I had like 12 blankets on, and I'm still freezing, because you're in the middle of the desert in January. It's cold.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, it's super cold. Yeah.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. And, it's scary. It's really scary going to jail. It was so scary. I get out and I meet prince charming. I'm not going to say he's an alcoholic, but he loved to drink the way I did. He was a really good boyfriend. I felt like this is a great relationship to get into. I get pregnant two months after knowing him. I was like, all right, are you ready to move in. Let's not get married, but let's definitely... I need help now. I'm pregnant and this is the first time, since I was 14, that I'm not drinking.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
What? Because you're pregnant.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I tried to drink. One time I got really jealous, and we were at a party. Because, I'm 19 years old. I'm still going out, I'm just not doing anything. I got really jealous, and I tried to drink, and I threw up. That was around being pregnant three months, and I was like, okay, I can't drink, because I have no tools. I have so much compassion for women who have no idea they have the disease of alcoholism. They get pregnant, and one, they can't stop drinking, because they have no choice. Because, if I could've chosen not to ruin my life by the age of 19 with two DUIs and just all the other chaos that comes along with it, which we do not have enough time to talk about, but I would've stopped drinking, or at least managed it better. Stop at two, maybe four. Get at least a good buzz. Four, I feel like, is a good buzz.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
We're not even capable of coming up with a plausible-
Nicole Ory:
A good number.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. Even our attempts at being moderate, in theory, don't work.
Nicole Ory:
I feel like four is a good moderation. Isn't it?
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Apparently, it's two.
Nicole Ory:
Oh, okay. Yeah, I guess there's just nothing in me that's moderate. Two does not sound like a good time.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, well, apparently it's two.
Nicole Ory:
All right, well.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
It's what the experts tell me.
Nicole Ory:
Well, good for you normal people. Sounds boring.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's why we don't drink.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, exactly.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Because, we're like, on what planet do you want to have two? That's a perfect example. It's zero or four. For me, it's like having, this speaks [inaudible 00:28:17], but it's like having a bite of a Snickers bar or whatever those-
Nicole Ory:
And then throwing it away.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah.
Nicole Ory:
That's so sad.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. It's like, I'd rather not have anything. I'm not trying to want the rest of it all day.
Nicole Ory:
For sure.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's not cool. Or, one goldfish. Forget it. It's not meant to be consumed in such small quantities. But, you know, I'm an alcoholic, so that fits. It checks out.
Peter Loeb:
Hi. I'm Peter Loeb, CEO and co-founder of Lionrock Recovery. We're proud to sponsor the Courage to Change, and I hope you find that it's an inspiration. I was inspired to start Lionrock after my sister lost her own struggle with drugs and alcohol, back in 2010. Because we provide care online by live video, Lionrock clients can get help from the privacy of home. We offer flexible schedules that fit our clients' busy lives. Of course, we're licensed and accredited, and we accept most private health insurance. You can find out more about us at lionrockreovery.com, or call us for a free consultation, no commitment, at 800-258-6550. Thank you.
Nicole Ory:
What I was saying about the compassion I feel for people who become pregnant, and they have no idea they have this disease, and I didn't know that I had it, I was able to stop. Not by choice. I got sick, and I smoked pot a couple times. I couldn't understand why he couldn't come home without drinking, because we're pregnant together now. I stopped drinking. Some women can't, and it's not a choice, and they carry around deep guilt and shame because of it, because they can't understand why they can't stop drinking. Alcohol [inaudible 00:30:12] in my mind for years, and now it's gone, and I'm left with me, and I don't have a sufficient substitute. I would call my mom balling.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
and hormones.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. And hormones, and I'm 20, and I'm living in this 400 square foot apartment. There was a freaking gas leak, I think.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, dear god.
Nicole Ory:
I'm calling the freaking... it's just chaos. That's where I end up. I would call my mom crying and be like, am I crazy? I feel crazy. I feel like a crazy person, because my head was just so loud. I had my daughter, and she was born really, really, sick. She was born with four heart defects. She had two holes in her heart. Her aorta wasn't connected. She had something called double outlet right ventricle, which happens to one every 100,000 babies. It's very rare. She's born really sick, and she had open heart surgery, I think, three of four days after she was born. She lived at the hospital. We would be there. I would be there 16 hours a day, go home, shower, come back.
Nicole Ory:
When I had gotten pregnant, this shows what my alcoholism looked like, or that I didn't even know that... I kind of forgot I had a problem when I was 19. The more that you drink, you just forget about it, and it's gone. When I was pregnant, I didn't think this is my chance to start new. I'm going to stop drinking. I'm going to be this great mom. I didn't think I needed a redo on life. I thought it was a given I would be a good mom. I'm having a baby. I'm just going to be a good mom. I'm going to turn 21 four months after she's born and my mom can watch her when I want to go out. That's my best thinking. I didn't think that I needed to stop what I was doing. I thought it was going to be automatic I'm not going to want to drink every day. I'll just drink on the weekends and my mom'll watch on the weekends.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You just thought that you were naturally going to transition into this next phase of life.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I didn't think-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Particularly given the ages that you were, that makes sense. You're 19, and those... I think we hide in a lot of those age ranges, like, Oh well, I'm 16. This what 16-year-olds do. I'm 19, this is what... Really, what we're doing is way beyond.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, for sure. She was born really sick. She was two weeks old and it was mine and this guy's one year anniversary. My mom was like, "Why don't you go out to dinner. I'll stay at the hospital with her." For me, I've had this mental obsession to drink for 10 months at this point. I was like, yeah, I deserve a break. This is hard. We go all the way out to East Mesa, because I'm still 20, but there's this one bar that'll serve me. I order these two really pretty red drinks. It was buy one get one. I had taken a sip, and my mom had called and said, "Get down to the hospital. You can hold your daughter." Her name was Addison. It was going to be the first time I was going to be able to hold her since she was born.
Nicole Ory:
This is what my alcoholism looks like. If I'm presented with an option to show up for life and drink, I don't get to choose after I take a drink. The choice gets removed from me. I sat there on the phone with what felt like five minutes, but it was 30 seconds, really debating, do I want to go the hospital and hold my daughter or do I want to stay here because I deserve this drink? Look what I'm going through. I can hold her tomorrow. Or, I'll be there later on tonight, and then I'll hold her. I'm just going back and forth through my head. By the grace of god, I made the decision, this is important, I need to get down there. I downed the drink first, and I'm like hold my daughter buzzed for the first time. I can see it in the pictures.
Nicole Ory:
There was a similar story that I heard around five months sober of someone who had to make the decision to either stay at the hospital with his girlfriend who was dying or go make last call. When I heard that at five months sober, it hit me like a ton of bricks, because I wasn't totally convinced, but I wasn't drinking at that point. It hit me like a ton of bricks. I will always choose drinking over life, no matter what the circumstances. That means I'm an alcoholic. I started grieving. I was sad that I was never going to be able to drink again. It felt like forever.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
When you got sober.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. That was just the story that reminded me of that when I was five months sober, because I was in the same situation. Go hold your daughter that you love more than anything. I loved her more than anything. What happened with her is she lived for another four weeks and we had to make the decision to take her off of life support. She just wasn't getting better. Her organs were failing, and so we did. We took her off of life support. I held her. It's kind of weird that I remember this. She passed away that night, and I remember standing outside. It was 5:00 in the morning, and I made this pact to myself.
Nicole Ory:
There were these drugs I was never going to do again. It was weird, because I was like, "I'm never going to do Ecstasy again. I'm never going to do acid again." The reasons behind it was I was so afraid of what I would see, instead of I need to change my life. Alcohol was still on the table. Alcohol was more on the table at this point than anything else, because now I really need it, because I have no coping skills for life. He went to prison three days after her funeral, her dad did. I was left with me. And then, I turned 21. It was just done. I would drink really hard Thursday through Sunday. Recover Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. I worked at a brewery where I could drink after. For the next three years, it was just trying... I was so angry and so hurt, and I didn't to counseling. None of my friends had kids. I was 20.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Did anyone suggest counseling?
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I tried once. I had state insurance and I went to this counselor. I couldn't really understand her that well. I was just like, this isn't working. Alcohol is a way better solution than this.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Well, it's much faster, yeah.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I still lived at home with my mom. Fast forward to my last couple weeks of using, I had developed these rules by this time. It's weird, so I don't know if my liver was shutting, because I definitely wasn't telling the doctor the truth. Towards the last five months of drinking, I started getting these rashes on my abdomen that were pretty severe. At night, my hands and my feet were swelling, and my arms were tensing up, and my leg. I was just so dehydrated but I would... Any time I would drink, I would get these rashes on my abdomen. I would go to the doctor and get steroid shots. I'd be like, I need another steroid shot, and he would give me one. It was not great. This is how important alcohol is to me. I started getting this rash, and I was like, gosh, I think I'm allergic to cotton.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Naturally. Yeah.
Nicole Ory:
I'm like, gosh, or I think maybe the laundry detergent. I need to by all hypoallergenic laundry detergent. I need to by natural shampoo and conditioner. I'd gotten this cat when my daughter passed away. I was like, gosh, could I have gotten allergic to the cat? I can't get rid of her. What am I going to do? It's all these things I'm trying to figure out.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Anything but.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. And then, I was like, well, maybe it's vodka. So, I'll just drink this instead. And then, I'm like, maybe it's the hops in the brewery that I work in. Just, when I got sober-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
How much do you think you were drinking a day?
Nicole Ory:
It would be at night. I wasn't a day drinker. I would go to work hungover, eat some bar... It was weird. I got hungover every single time. I threw up a lot at night. I had the spins at night. In my head, I was like, you're doing this to yourself, so these other consequences, and just suck it up. You got to keep moving forward. I would have the whole wake up in random places and have the shame guilt, and be like, oh my gosh, why did I do this? I'm not going to drink tonight. But, as the day goes on, I take a shower, I'm feeling better. You're overreacting. You're not going drink as much tonight, and then it would be the same thing over, and over, and over.
Nicole Ory:
I started making these rules. I started trying to control it. I don't know if there were totally rules, but I was trying to control it. So, I'm going to smoke pot instead, and I'll be the designated driver. These are two ways to control not drinking. But then, I'd go out and it'd be like, this sucks. I'm so bored. Everyone else is dancing and having fun, because they're really drunk. So, I would take like five shots to get high away. Totally normal.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Totally normal.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. And then, it'd be great. That's how my last night of drinking was. I smoked pot. We were all going out. I'll be the designated driver. I get there. This sucks. Drink some shots. Everyone else figure out a way home, I'm taking a cab home. Well, we all ended up coming over to my house. I wanted to go get some more pot next door, so I go over there. They're not answering. And then, I come back and this guy has coke out on the table. I had these rules about cocaine that I had made around 19. If I can't get it by 11:00, don't do it. I don't know why.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, I'm not sure why.
Nicole Ory:
11:00 just felt like a good-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Cut off?
Nicole Ory:
Yeah.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
It's like last call for blow.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. Yeah.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Blow last call.
Nicole Ory:
If I couldn't before-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I'll with it.
Nicole Ory:
It doesn't make a different.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
No. Absolutely not. It might make a difference in terms of how much sleep you get. That's the only thing I can think of that-
Nicole Ory:
But, I'm going to bed at like 9:00 a.m. no matter what.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Right, okay. Yeah, no, you're right.
Nicole Ory:
Or, maybe not. If I get at 2:00 a.m., then, you know.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, yeah. The only thing that I could think of is that you were like, "I'll be high from 11:00 to whatever, and then I'll be ready for work in the morning." The thing is, with coke, it's like there's no stopping. Once you-
Nicole Ory:
If I can get more, I'll do it forever.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, oh god. I always call it the drug of more. I think the high is the feeling of I need more. I'm not even sure what the high is other than... I immediately-
Nicole Ory:
I loved it though. I still have hard time watching it on TV.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Me too.
Nicole Ory:
Alcohol I'm totally fine with, which is weird, because I drank way more than I did coke. If I see it on TV, I'm like, oh.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Because, the way people do it on TV is sexy.
Nicole Ory:
That looks great.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
The way that we do it is not.
Nicole Ory:
I felt so glamorous though.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Did you?
Nicole Ory:
I looked down to junkies on meth, and I'm like, "I do coke."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, that's-
Nicole Ory:
I remember my best friend being like, because she was a meth head, and I'm like, "That's so gross." She was like, "You do coke." I'm like, "Yeah, it's glamorous."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. You-
Nicole Ory:
And I believed it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I believe that.
Nicole Ory:
Like I'm a rock star.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I believe that. I had a special way of taking something that was glamorous and making it look like gutter punk.
Nicole Ory:
Oh, I looked like complete trash. I felt like I was glamorous.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
And honey, that's all that matters.
Nicole Ory:
It's all about perception.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I feel like I look beautiful. Okay, so-
Nicole Ory:
I probably did to some of the people, because they were all trashed too.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh my god, she's still like, "Well, maybe I did to someone." Okay, well, a girl can dream.
Nicole Ory:
With the laxed face by the end of night for the alcohol and, you know.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You were hot. What can we say? Okay, so you'd be 11:00 p.m. You blow past 11:00, literally, past 11:00.
Nicole Ory:
2:00 a.m. I get back and I was like, beep it. Let's party.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Ride or die, right?
Nicole Ory:
Then, somehow we leave my house. I'm talking about politics and religion, which I know nothing about. I don't know anything about it at this point.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's the other thing coke does.
Nicole Ory:
I definitely do on cocaine. I know everything. The party's over at 10:00 a.m. I don't want the party to be over. Everyone's like, "No, we're going home." I'm like, "Wait, why?"
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Such a bad feeling.
Nicole Ory:
Let's keep partying. Why? We're having so much fun. Don't leave. I get home.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You're 22.
Nicole Ory:
I'm 22. I'm 23.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, you're 23. It's your last... Yeah.
Nicole Ory:
Yep. I'm 23. We get home, still living with my mom. I think she was out of town. I don't know. It's like, goals, right? I'm 23 living at home, and I roll out of bed at 3:50, because I have to be at work at 4:00. I call my boss first right when I get home, and I'm like, "I can't come into work tonight." I was like, "I haven't slept." He was like, "Well, you have to be here, so get here at 4:00." I'm crying. I'm like, "I can't. I can't come in." I have to go in. 3:50 I roll out of bed. I have to be there at 4:00. I look in the mirror, and I have this moment of clarity. This woman that I used to be in a home group with, Stacy, would say, "A moment of clarity was when God stops the lies long enough for us to see the truth."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Oh, I love that.
Nicole Ory:
It's so good, right?
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
God stops the lies long enough for us to see the truth.
Nicole Ory:
The truth was it wasn't because I had an abusive childhood, or my daughter died, or I felt uncomfortable with not having friends, or whatever the story was at any point in my life, or that he went to prison, or all of these things. That wasn't why my life was the way it was. My life was never going to get better if I didn't stop drinking and using. That's how I was able to see the truth. My dad had gotten sober two years prior to me. He tried to get me to go to the Flagstaff Roundup once by saying, "There'll be cute boys there." I was like, "Oh, I might come."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That usually worked for me.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. Then he said, "But, you can't drink all weekend." I was like, "Mm, I can't come." I just can't.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Wow, we just went from a 10 to a zero.
Nicole Ory:
I was so disconnected. Me hanging out with my family was me coming over on a Sunday laying on the couch hungover asking for $20 when I left. I thought I was being good daughter. Saying, "I'll pay you back," knowing damn well I was never paying that $20 back.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I think they knew damn well too.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. I needed that. I remember getting sober and actually paying them back. He was like, "Whoa. You're paying me back what you borrowed?" I didn't have to borrow any money after about six months sober ever again. I was able to be self sufficient and not spend $100 at the bar, or whatever it would be. He took me to my first meeting. He was really smart. He called his sponsor. He said, "Take her to this Young Peoples meeting."
Nicole Ory:
There was this Alano Club over on 64th Street and Thomas. It was kind of like the Canyon Club. There was a lounge, and a snack bar, and a lot of young people. It was a 10:00 meeting, and I saw cute boys. I looked a mess. I'm in sweats and an oversized sweatshirt. I'm six days sober, which is the longest I had been sober at that point. I didn't raise my hand for less than 30 days. When they said, "Do you want a 24-hour chip?", my dad kicked me under the table. I got up. Now, everyone knows I'm new. The meeting topic was God shots. My dad just reminded me of that the other day. He came and saw me speak a couple weeks ago.
Nicole Ory:
At the end of the meeting they read a vision for you. This guys said, "Nicole, will you come up and read a vision for you?" I was like, [inaudible 00:47:08]. I had to walk up all these stairs and there's this podium and stage. I'm up there and I'm reading it, and it was the first time I had felt hope in forever. I was like, maybe this can work for me. Maybe I can have a life back. At that point, I didn't care if I was never going to have fun again. I just wanted to be free. I was in a prison for so long, and I felt hope. I circled the Alano Club a couple times, like, will someone talk to me please? I don't know what to do? My dad's like, "What are you doing?" I'm like, "I don't know." I don't know what I'm doing.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I don't know what to do with my hands.
Nicole Ory:
There was this girl, Jessica, who was visiting from New York. She introduced me to a couple of people, and I came back the next day. I was like, okay. I still went to bars, because I didn't know what to do with myself. That was my life, and I would drink six Red Bulls in one night, and feel like I was coming down off of cocaine. It was fucking terrible. That was the first month sober. I kept going to meetings every single day. I got a sponsor. I had a lot of sponsors my first year sober.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Which is abnormal.
Nicole Ory:
I fired so many. Yeah, it's not normal. Most people get a sponsor and they do the suggestions. Me, I was like, "I'm not wrong. Fired." Then, I would get another one and do steps one, two, and three. Then, we'd get to four, and you're fired. And then, steps one, two, and three. Then, I wanted to date this guy, and he was like, "I won't date you unless you work the steps." I was like, "All right, I'll work the steps." So, I worked the steps. I got so much freedom from it. God knew what I needed, the validation. My codependency was alive and well at that time. I got the freedom that I needed, and I got really involved in service. I still had this codependency thing going on.
Nicole Ory:
At around a year and a half sober I started dating someone who relapsed a lot and couldn't stay sober. My best thinking around three years sober was, if I just go do heroin with him, then we can be together. That's scary.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's terrifying.
Nicole Ory:
I've never done heroin in my life.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, that's terrifying. But that's-
Nicole Ory:
That was my best thinking.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
My codependency came up so intensely early on in sobriety. Really scary. Really scary thinking. As crazy as that sounds, I understand that mindset where you're just trying to... I was in a situation where the boyfriend I had relapsed. We were both sober. He relapsed, and he was on parole, so him relapsing was a big deal. He took me to a party where they were swinging, but I was the only one that was, A, sober, and B, that didn't know.
Nicole Ory:
Wait. What do mean by swinging?
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Like swingers.
Nicole Ory:
Oh my god.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
They were swingers. Everybody was swinging. I thought we were going to a couples barbecue. Everybody was swingers. I didn't know, and I'm the only one sober. Talk about feeling like an idiot. This was the kind of thing. It got super weird from there. I was like, "Wait a minute. Wait a minute. What's going on?" Oh my gosh.
Nicole Ory:
That's what you would do if [crosstalk 00:50:32].
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I'll leave out the details, but basically I, A, stuck around. I didn't get into the swinging. I was like, "No dude. Not happening." He did start making out with somebody else's wife. I was like, "I don't know what's happening right now."
Nicole Ory:
Oh my god.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Literally, was, you know. This happens. Things are going really weird, and I still stick around, because I'm like... Then, I'm like, okay, well do I need to become a swinger? I'm not really into that, but, oh. You start considering. Luckily, I was like, no, I do not need to... I'm not doing that. This is absolute insanity. I went to a party, my boyfriend starts making out with some dude's wife in front of him. This is insane. And, he's using. This is the kind of stuff where the... But, I need the validation, and I don't want to change boy... I don't want to lose him. We start thinking-
Nicole Ory:
You move your line, just like in alcoholism. Move your line of what's acceptable.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. Yeah. So, I'm not a swinger. But, that happened. Did you do heroin?
Nicole Ory:
No. I stayed sober. I think my saving grace was I still was involved in Alcoholics Anonymous. I had sponsees. I served on committees. I was in the middle, but I started not telling my friends about getting back together with him, because there was so much shame. People were tired of hearing about it. I was tired of talking about it. It was exhausting.
Nicole Ory:
I remember, one time hanging with him, and leaving his house, and saying, "I'm not telling anyone about this." My next though was, "Then you're going to get loaded." I texted my sponsor and I said, "I just hung out with him. I don't want any secrets, but I don't want to talk about it." She was like, "Okay." I didn't have the secrets. That's what'll get me loaded is feeling like I can't say what is going on in my life, because I'm experiencing shame or guilt. It got really bad and my codependency progressed. We finally called it off, but it felt like... I kept going to counseling for my daughter, but I would start talking about them, whoever I was dating. That would be my focal point. I remember having a counselor saying, "If you get back with him, I can't counsel you anymore." I was like, "Then, this is over, because I can't stop." I couldn't stop. I never went back to her again.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I totally get that.
Nicole Ory:
I was like, "Well, I don't know how to not do this." It was just like with alcoholism. I would go for counseling for my daughter. I would talk about them. Finally, my friends begged me to call this woman, and was like, "Will you please go through the CoDa steps?" I was like, "Yeah. I'm willing."
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Codependency Anonymous.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah, Codependents Anonymous. I started meeting with her, and I started going to this counselor and seeing him once a week every week for a year on belief systems. I got down to some causes and conditions of why my belief systems were the way they were. It was really eye opening, but it was also really painful seeing the unavailability of my dad when I was younger. I was trying to recreate this role and these partners that I was dating that were totally unavailable. I remember going to my counselor and saying, "This is what I want in a partner." He said, "No. You want to want that. If you had that, you would be bored." He also said I was addicted to unhappiness, which I was completely appalled by, and cried, and stormed out of his room. How dare you say that? No one's addicted to being unhappy.
Nicole Ory:
Fast forward, because it ties in with this part, I go through the counseling and I meet my current husband. I do the CoDA steps and all these things. I was terrified to get into a relationship. He's everything that I would've never dated, because he's available, and he's kind, and he's loving, and he's considerate, and all of these things. I would've seen that as weak. My perception of a man was so skewed. I have to make you want me. He just wanted me. We get engaged and we're about to married, and I start sabotaging things.
Nicole Ory:
I go into this new counselor to... I started doing EMDR, which I had done at three years sober. On my childhood, I started doing EMDR, which helped a lot with healing with my parents. Then, I went in to try and do EMDR on my daughter. The thing is, is I had accepted that she passed. There wasn't trauma surrounding that. I don't know if we call it trauma, but the issue was I felt guilty being happy and successful in life, because if I was happy, then she doesn't matter. How can I be happy when my daughter passed away? We did do EMDR. She was really creative with it. I saw a picture, a flash of me and my husband walking down the aisle and I'm just laughing. I'm so happy. I just start balling, because I feel so guilty that I'm moving on. He had a two-year-old daughter that I got to be stepmom to. It was really hard, because I hadn't... I had no one ever talk to about her. Even sober, when I got sober, I didn't talk about her at all.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Addison?
Nicole Ory:
Mm-mm (negative). I cut that part out of my life. And then, around three years sober, all of my friends started having kids. I was so grateful that their kids were healthy. I feel messed up saying it, but also it turned around to, well, why was my kid born sick, and they all get to have healthy kids? That's when I started seeking counseling for it. A couple years ago, one of my best friends, Kara's, daughter passed away. I showed up for her. I talked about Addison more since that happened than I ever had my entire life, since she was born. There was a lot of healing that came from that.
Nicole Ory:
Though I would've never wanted that to happen to my daughter, I'd much rather have her here, I can say no experience I've ever gone through has been in vain, nothing. With all the pain that I went through with losing her, with all the pain that I went through in that codependent relationship and sobriety... I remember, in that relationship, being on the ground crying, and being like, "God, this better not be in vain, because this hurts really bad." I was detoxing. When you make the decision to not date or talk... I couldn't have male friends. I couldn't have Facebook. I couldn't Instagram. I could not get validation in any way. It's like a physical detox.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's [crosstalk 00:57:27].
Nicole Ory:
It's the most uncomfortable thing. It was harder than getting sober.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. No, because you're sober while you're doing it. What's so fascinating about that is the experiment of how much validation do we get that we don't even know.
Nicole Ory:
So much.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
No, right. It's so much. You did that. I can't even imagine. Yeah.
Nicole Ory:
It was terrible. The girls that I sponsor now, when I'm like, "Okay. This is what I did." I'm like, I know. You feel like you want to rip your skin off right now. It's excruciating. I get it. There's hope on the other side of this. There's freedom on the other side.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Your friends started having babies and you're raising your husband's daughter. What does your life look like today?
Nicole Ory:
Today, it's really good. My husband just celebrated a year sober in February.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
That's awesome.
Nicole Ory:
There was a little relapse in there. He pulled it together and he's killing the game. I get to work for an amazing company, Lionrock, which I love. I feel of total use and purpose.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
This is not a plant. I didn't plant this by the way. It's not a plant.
Nicole Ory:
I worked at University of Phoenix for 12 years. Since 2011, I wasn't happy. But, I stayed. It was a good income. I had great benefit. I got to work from home sometimes, but I wasn't happy, and I wasn't living to my fullest potential, but I stayed anyways. I love that I get to tell people, I love my job. I love what I do. I love the people that I work with. My daughter's 10. She's my stepdaughter, daughter. She's starting a new school. She's doing really good. Everything's really good. I mean, I go to AA. I sponsor. I have a sponsor. I stay connected.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
What's the single greatest thing that shows up for you when you know that you're recovery's in trouble?
Nicole Ory:
I start disconnecting from my sponsor first.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
What does that look like?
Nicole Ory:
I stop calling and checking in. Because, I do a weekly check-in. When I first got sober, I would call my sponsor five times a day. What do I do now? She's like, "Go take a shower." Okay. I'll go take a shower. Now, it's like life's really good. I check in once a week. I also see her at my women's meeting. I go to women's meeting every Sunday. What it looks like, I made this commitment two years ago. I don't get to have balance anymore. I know that sounds weird.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah, that sounds weird.
Nicole Ory:
When I got five years sober, I felt like I'd arrived. I don't need to sponsor as many girls. I don't need to go to as many meetings. I started putting rules on sobriety. If they don't have a car, I can't sponsor them. If they don't call me before this time, I'm not picking up the phone. I started putting all these rules on it, because I need balance. I need to balance my life. I got really sick, and really miserable, and really isolated. Thankfully, I didn't get loaded. Because, I was still going to one meeting a week. I was doing the minimum, but I wasn't all in. I love being all in.
Nicole Ory:
A couple years ago, I made the decision, I'm going all in and I don't get to pull back. What that looks like for me, my typical week is I work Monday through Friday. My weekends are spent sponsoring. Then, I go to a Friday night meeting with my husband. Saturday night, sometimes we'll go to a meeting together. And then, I have my Sunday morning woman's meeting. I get filled up every weekend. Then, during the week, I have a couple things I read. I talk to my sponsees. I'm all in.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
You're all in. It's integrated into your life. Before we wrap up, how did you stay sober through the relapse of your husband?
Nicole Ory:
There was a lot of sneakiness going on. I didn't know all the time. I never really knew what... I thought I was being someone sober. There's no way I could be in denial. I never really understood what denial was until I was in it. I can now see that there were things that I justified, behaviors and all these things. I was still connected. It wasn't in my house. I never saw the act. I think that, that's a huge difference there. I wasn't three years sober living in codependency anymore thinking, well, I'll just join him.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Right. You have all these tools and you were connected.
Nicole Ory:
It was, this isn't okay for my life anymore, and so you need to either make a decision to get sober or you have to leave, because I can't do this anymore. Thankfully, he said he'll try again. He didn't think it was going to work. If you go all in, AA is that powerful. You have to have the ability to have this honesty and this willingness to be able to continue to show up every day, even when you think it's not going to work. I didn't think it was going to work, when I did the CoDA steps or the AA steps. I did not think it was going to work, but I had no other choice but to try.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Yeah. Yeah, I mean it's interesting. We're talking a lot about 12 step. My experience is that the combination of the treatment that I did, the actual therapy that I did, and then creating a life in... 12 step programs was what worked for me, and it sounds like that's what worked for you is the combination of those things. One thing, I'm married to someone who's in recovery. One thing we talk about, we've actually literally talked about, what does it look like if one of us goes out? Because, we are no longer the same person that the other person married. We've had conversations about, okay, if I pick up... That doesn't mean, if I pick up and it's out of control. That means if I pick up period. If I pick up period. Because, I'm a heroin addict. I don't know how long it'll take me to get there, but I'll get there.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
We've had conversations about, okay, so one of us is loaded. Your job is to protect the children. What either one of us will do, like an emergency plan. It's sad. It's sad to have that conversation, but it's also this is the reality that those of us living with this disease have. I think, you've been through it. My sponsor's actually been through relapse with her husband. I know other people too. The people who make it out the best are the ones that were already doing everything they needed to do for themselves, where their recovery was on point. Their recovery, it was integrated into their life. It wasn't an emergency go back to. It was a, okay, I'm already going to meetings. I'm already connected with other people. I already have a support system. Now, I get to utilize that.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Because, one thing I have done in recovery is let go of my recovery, in terms of all the things that we do for it, all the meetings, all the service, all the different things, and then come into massive conflict crisis. Then, I'm reaching back. I'm reaching back, I'm like, please come back. Please come back, particularly with boyfriends, whatever. You drop all your friends, that kind of thing. And then you re-
Nicole Ory:
It takes a while to get back.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Exactly. And so, you're reaching back and people... It doesn't come back right away, but that's when you really need it. The way to fare best when life happens, because life does happen, is that you are already connected. You're already there. It sounds like that was really huge for you.
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. Because, I had made that commitment before he got sober, because I did get more disconnected through time. I was like, I did not get sober to be miserable at all.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Right. Well, that's the thing. That's the thing. That's a big thing we talk about. I'm getting sober so that I can have a happy, joyous, free life. If that's not what's going on, then I don't want to be sober.
Nicole Ory:
Exactly.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
I reserve the right not to be. I reserve the right not to live miserably. For me, with alcohol and drugs, I can't live with them and I can't live without them, so I need something else. You have an incredible story and I love the peace, the work that you've done in Codependents Anonymous and all the difference tools that you've used, because I know you've worked really hard and used all those different tools. You've been through some stuff in sobriety, man. You really have. Surgeries and-
Nicole Ory:
Yeah. We didn't even talk about that. That's okay. There's not-
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
But, I mean-
Nicole Ory:
It's a whole life.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
It's just you've been through life, and you're thriving. I think you're just a really wonderful example of all the different ways that recovery can work. I'm really grateful to know you and be part of your journey.
Nicole Ory:
Thank you. Thanks for having me.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
Thanks for being here.
Nicole Ory:
I appreciate it.
Ashley Loeb Blassingame:
The Courage to Change, a recovery podcast would like to thank our sponsor, Lionrock Recovery, for their support. Lionrock Recovery provides online substance abuse counseling where you can get help from the privacy of your own home. For more information visit www.lionrockrecovery.com/podcast. Subscribe and join our podcast community to hear amazing stories of courage and transformation. We're so grateful to our listeners and hope that you will engage with us. Please email us comments, questions, anything you want to share with us, how this podcast has affected you. Our email address is podcast@lionrockrecovery.com. We want to hear from you.